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New Dev Blog: Fixing Lag: Character Nodes

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 18 post(s)
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.08.21 04:28:00 - [1] Originally by: CCP Atlas This sort of change will speed up utility functions that don't impact your solar system directly. Your client should seem a bit 'spiffier' when talking to the server. You won't see an fps increase but you don't have to wait as long for things like loading up the map, right clicking on other players and things of that nature. There is also a bit less for the location node to do so it has more buffer for the pew-pew. Yeah.. map is way more speedy than it was - VERY GOOD work there. If the mail just could handle as well?! I just cleared the cache of my mail and it seems a bit faster now.. why isn't this 'clear the cache' an automated process when closing down the client? On a more related note.. what comprises the services the location node is handling actually? Would you be able to give us a list of stuff this node handles pretty please? And yeah.. best blog of the lot so far!
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.08.21 04:39:00 - [2] Originally by: CCP Atlas Originally by: Mashie Saldana With these new nodes, would it be possible to have dedicated AI nodes to bring Sleeper AI to all NPCs in EVE? Actually, the NPC AI is a perfect example of a system that needs to live on the location node. However, there are not any outstanding scalability issue with that. There are no technical reasons Sleeper AI or something akin to that isn't on more or all NPC's, it's a game mechanical / balancing issue which is outside my expertise... Why does the NPC AI need to live on the location node? What services do (and need) to live on the location node anyways.. hm, I'm repeating myself here..
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.08.21 05:31:00 - [3] Edited by: Tres Farmer on 21/08/2010 05:34:53 Originally by: Siiee Originally by: Tres Farmer Why does the NPC AI need to live on the location node? What services do (and need) to live on the location node anyways.. hm, I'm repeating myself here.. If I'm understanding it right you can think of the location node as the "local" node. You can only interact (pew pew) with NPCs that are on grid with you at your location (and the grid is attached to your solar system instance), and thus it has to be on the location node. I can interact (pew pew) with other players who are NOT running their thought-processes on that local node. The reason we got so dumb NPC might be just because the sleeper AI uses x-times more cpu and is only bearable in w-space where you don't got so many PvE'ers as in k-space. You see where I'm going with this?! Let's say CCP manages to 'outsource' NPC AI onto other node(s). Want more intelligent NPC? Just install more NPC nodes.. I can't argue on facts here as my knowledge of the server and the processes are so tiny. So any insight from Atlas is highly appreciated. So again.. a table with services running on the local node and their load (might even need diff cases listed like Jita/PvE/PvP) would be needed for us all to look at..
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.08.21 05:45:00 - [4] Edited by: Tres Farmer on 21/08/2010 05:45:39 Originally by: Nareg Maxence Originally by: Tres Farmer Why does the NPC AI need to live on the location node? What services do (and need) to live on the location node anyways.. hm, I'm repeating myself here.. The AI needs to control the NPCs which are part of the space simulation. It needs do decide whether the NPC flies up or down or left or right or shoots at you or warps away. Anything that's part of the space simulation needs to be on the location node. I guess it is technically possible that you could treat NPCs as a ships controlled by a computer player, just like we have our ships and we control them via the client. The question is what that would accomplish. In low load systems with people just ratting or mining or whatever, there wouldn't be much point in trying to offload the probably fairly low contribution to load that the AI accounts for. Low load is never the reason to something, that's right. Originally by: Nareg Maxence In high load systems where there are fleet fights or system like jita, people aren't interacting with the AI, so it's idle anyway. Well it doesn't need to be idle then, does it? At the moment PvE in high load systems isn't worth it because of the problems it causes.. What was there first - the egg or the chuck? Btw.. we don't have orbiting planets/moons/stations because of the load they cause on the server.. ever thought of a way around this? Have a Orbital-Bodies-Node and let it do the calcs needed for all the stuff that's supposed to be moving. If a player enters system his client talks to this node and get's up to date information about all the orbiting bodies and their status. We should have orbiting planets. No? Originally by: Nareg Maxence The only situation where I could see a possible benefit, would be in mission hubs, but then you will have to replace the direct interaction of the AI with a message passing system to get the commands from the AI node to the location node and back. Thinking of the amount of NPCs that spawn and despawn all the time, it seems to me that this would increase network traffic on the node by an unacceptable amount, and would there then be a benefit at all? I have no fricking clue because I have no idea about the services running on the location node nor the load each of the services cause under all those cases.. do you?
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.08.21 06:14:00 - [5] Originally by: Siiee Originally by: Tres Farmer I can interact (pew pew) with other players who are NOT running their thought-processes on that local node. The "thought process" is irrelevant (and absolutely trivial, even Sleeper AI is still fairly basic from my experience with it, only barely more "intelligent" and more random). Normal NPC AI tends to boil down to something like this (bolded the important part) -- if(ships_on_grid) shootAt(first_ship_on_grid) -- We'll who here would like more intelligent NPC? Ok, who here does have an idea or know if this is possible with the current implementation of things.. like NPC AI on the location node? Originally by: Siiee selecting a target from a list, not difficult, but that information of the first ship on the grid is only available in the solar system simulation, and so has to occur on the location node. If you were to run NPC AI on a separate node it would need to have all of that grid information available from the location node, and you'd end up having to maintain two separate copies of the same information, lots of additional overhead, not worth it. How much information is that? The position of non-NPC ships, aka players on the local grid? Wow.. that's really a big chunk of information there.. Look.. the space-simulation-service does all the calcs for physics, the weapons, the movements.. all that buzz.. NPC AI doesn't need access to that data. Players can't get access to that data either for others on the same grid. Why should NPC need that? Originally by: Siiee They would be better off working on breaking the location node away from a single Sol (think a grid-sized location) which would accomplish a lot more in the grand scheme of things. and how do you streamline things? Do grids with POS or Custom Office need a NPC AI service idling around?
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2010.08.22 02:43:00 - [6] Originally by: CCP Atlas Originally by: Tres Farmer ... And why does it take +30seconds for the mail window to be responsive after opening it the first time in the actual client session? This just looks broken! What is it waiting for? New mails? Why can't it show the old mails.. all that had been cached already and should be saved locally on my hdd right away with the menu on the left? And then if new ones come in have it show them.. Making me wait for this is not user friendly! ... This doesn't sound like the way it should work. Can you submit a bug report for us? Mention me please so that I get it. Bug Report ID is 99609. Good luck!

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